Hello every body i am new here but it feels like the right place to be for a beginner barista like my self, my first question is about my espresso mahcine choise , i am confused between "Bezzera elisse semi automatic 2 group" and "Nuavo u simonelli premier MAXI 2 group" and "Cimbali m29 2 group" so any advice..?

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I would say firstly look at the depth and reputation of the machine manufacturers agent in Turkey. There is, of course, a difference between the machines produced by LaCimbali, Bezzera, Astoria, Nouvo Simonelli etc... but at the end of the day the ability for the agent to service your machine is perhaps going to help you to determine which to go with. They are all reputable brands. I personally prefer a semiautomatic option.
ALun thanks a lot for your help...the truth is all of them have a good agents,,, but the truth is the the price difference is like this,,, Cimbali is 2500$ and bezzera is 2400$ and Nuavo Simonelli is 2850$ so whats your say ??
other thing is regarding Syrups , i have to decide between Philibet Routin and Monin.. so again whats your choise would be....again thanks a lot for the help
I would not go with the la cimbali- have used an m29 for the last 2 1/2 years and it has been a very disappointing experience. It has a very small boiler and the heat fluctuates quite a lot. Have never used a bezzera but have had fantastic experiences with simonelli machines. Are you buying for a shop or home use?
go for the Nuova.......
I would in this case second Adams opinion. $400 difference might seem a lot at this stage, but actually the investment in paying a bit more will be worth it.

Adam Ptasnik said:
go for the Nuova.......
If you have the financial resources to purchase these machines, I strongly suggest:

Nuova Simonelli Aurelia

or

La Marzocco Linea

I've used the Bezzera, the M29 and a random Nuova and I do not think those machines have the capability or finesse that the Linea or Aurelia possess. They will cost you more but the extra cost will be worth it in terms of usability, flexibility and potential product quality.
The real question you should be asking yourself should be: "Where in the espresso quality spectrum do I want to operate?" If you can asnwer that question honestly, and understand what the answer means and are prepared to work hard to achieve that goal will control your choice of the machine.

Do you want to serve the very best?, Are you shooting for the average?, Will you settle for mediocre?, Or Do you want to be no worse than others?

I know everyone I have talked to at the trade shows wants to serve the very best. If they all knew what it really meant we could walk into any shop in the US and walk out with an exceptional espresso/espresso based drinks. You know that is not the case today. Not even close.

While you can make exceptional espresso with just about any commercial machine in the right hands, it is a lot easier with some than with others.

Having decided on espresso quality, the second issue to be addressed is barista training. How well trained are the barista working in your shop going to be? Can you keep their barista skills up?

Only with these questions honestly answered can you really select your machine.

Good Luck.
From the prices you are giving, I will assume these are all used machines. In that case, look inside the boiler for any mineral deposit and check all valve and coil functions as well as making sure any control boards are clean and fully functioning. Most important, use it before you buy it.
I like the Cimbali, otherwise. But it's really a good grinder that you need.
thanks sp much for all the attention that i got ,, from you guys ,,,, thats so hepfull,, as for Jonathan : its for a new coffee shop ,,as for Dr Joseph thanks for your explenation and let me tell you that i am really looking for the best cup of coffee,, but i am relly limited to these options in my country so what do you say,? " i picked my mind on Illy espresso beans " as for sarah,,, al these machines are brand new...again thanks every body i love this place..:)
Most new comers spend most of their budget on an espresso machine and then buy the cheapest grinder they can find.

When it comes to producing high quality espresso, the grinder is far more important than the espresso machine. It is the grinder that shaves the beans across the cell walls and exposes the coffee in the cells for extraction. Get a very high quality grinder that can keep its shaft alignment for the longest time. When the shafts are no longer in perfect alignment, the burrs are no longer parallel, placing limits on how fine a grind can be achieved.

Also look for a grinder with continuous adjsutments permitting small variations in grind settings.

All espresso machines do three things: they heat water; deliver a pre-measured amount of water when a particular button is pressed; and, pressurize the water for delivery to the portafilter. All of them can make mediocre espresso in the hands of a poorly trained barista. A highly capable barista can coax exceptional espresso using any of these machines.

Machines vary in quality depending on how well they do these functions regardless of how many shots are made in a given time.

There are lots of issues to consider when selecting an espresso machine to provide high quality espresso. Of all the issues such as, pre-infusion, ease of programming, ergonomics, access to service,......, the most critical is temperature stability in a shop environment where production rates vary widely from time to time.

This is where the multiple boiler machines have a definite edge over the single boiler machines.

Good Luck.
I agree on the Nuova Simonelli Aurelia. Even though it is a single boiler/HX machine it offers exceptional temperature stability and is very refined overall. Things of this nature come with a hefty price, but buy the best machine and grinder you possibly can because it will pay off down the road.

Also, exactly what will this machine/grinder be used for? Commercial setting or home? Sorry if you posted this earlier....

Regarding syrups, we have found Monin to be the best we've tried so far. Definitely the best natural flavor without being oversweetened. It may cost a little more, but less of it is needed to get the same end result. Later!
shadow... the machine and the grinder is for a coffee shop. now body till now recomended bezzera,,? amy reason why??

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