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Permalink Reply by Maggie Cook on March 5, 2009 at 8:52pm

What experiences do you have? Have you been a barista? What was your motivation for starting a coffee shop? That might give people info to start with

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Permalink Reply by Clint Slagle on March 6, 2009 at 2:25am

"Favorite machines? Syrups? Chocolates? Menu items? Tricks of the trade? Do's and Don'ts!"

I'm assuming you have your coffee program taken care of as its not on your list of worries?
As for machines I am partial to an FB-70 myself. Fb-80's/gb-5's are a better choice if you plan on changing your espresso occasionally. As for the other stuff, you'll have to ask someone else.

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Permalink Reply by Brady on March 6, 2009 at 4:11am

Welcome to bX, CB. You've come to the right place. Agreeing with Maggie's post - a little more info would be nice.

Going off of your profile info, looks like you have little to no experience in the industry. I'm not going to lie - that is going to be a huge challenge for you. You can learn a lot here and by watching things work at your neighborhood shop, but nothing can replace first-hand experience, either from working behind a bar for several months at a local shop or by attending one of the coffee schools... preferrably both.

In the meantime, spend lots of time in your neighborhood shops. If you don't have any, then drive as far as you need to to see good ones. Pay attention to the things you like, the things you don't, the things that seem to work well. Try to notice every detail and notice if it was part of your first impression. Drink lots of coffee from lots of different people. Observe, taste. Watch how their work flows when your order is filled and determine if it was effective or not. Go at different times of the day to see how things flow.

Partner with a quality local roaster. They often provide training, startup support, equipment advice, sales, and service and will do everything they can to help you succeed.

Seriously, if your first-hand experience is as limited as you've indicated on your profile, I would make addressing that your first priority. Far more important than the questions you've posed.

Best of luck.

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Permalink Reply by Mike Spence on March 6, 2009 at 8:11am

I think you are off to a good start by coming here! From here, start looking at training and consulting help - Start with the American Barista & Coffee School. Also choose a great roaster - one that provides not just the coffee but also help with making sure you will be successful.

And to echo Brady - Spend time in other shops and seeing how it is done there.

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Permalink Reply by CoffeeBuzzMN on March 6, 2009 at 9:44am

thanks Brady, i appreciate your input but the lack of information on my profile is a personal choice and NOT a reflection of my experience.

The purpose of my post was really to hear people's preferences in regard to different brands to help with my purchasing choices.

I would also love to hear words of wisdom from those who own their own places, as I am a first time owner--which again does not reflect my experience in the industry.

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Permalink Reply by Randy on March 6, 2009 at 10:59am

I understand the logic behind there being no such thing as a 20 oz cappuccino. You're right! There is no such thing as a 20oz capp, but I would suggest giving the customer what it wants. If they're willing to pay for a 20 oz capp, let them buy one. Why not try developing the customers tastes into more realistic sizes over time? Why can't we meet the customer on their level and then bring their awareness of quality coffee up? The best barista in the whole Kansas City Area (in my opinion) started off drinking a 16oz iced hazelnut latte with 5 pumps of hazelnut and 4 shots. That's a gross drink. But by chance he stumbled upon a quality coffee shop in town that is now known as Revo Coffee (said barista does not and has not worked there if you're looking for clues). He ordered his typical disgusting beverage, but when he took a sip of it, it was the best his beverage has ever tasted, so he asked them about it. This experience is what spurred him to learn more about coffee and become a barista. Since he has developed his skills and become the best barista in Kansas City.

Anazao said:

Have a solid concept, a plan, and enough money/time to see it through. La Marzocco is great, very dependable, Mazzer grinders are great, Routin 1883 syrups are in my opinion the best and not as common as Torani but they are a little more $, Ghiradelli & Routin sauces are my favorite, there is no such thing as a 20oz. cappuccino (unless you use 6 shots of espresso). However, in this time, all the best equipment and the fanciest additives are meaningless without a solid business plan. Please, if you have any specific questions you can message me. God bless.

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Permalink Reply by Jon Mitchell on March 6, 2009 at 11:01am

Hey CB, I'm in your position too. I'm working on a business plan currently to start up a coffee bar in my hometown in Arkansas. I also have never been an owner nor do I have much experience as a Barista but I didn't go to class at the American Barista and Coffee school which is exposed me to quite a bit of knowledge in a short amount of time. Experience is great and I'm working on getting more of that too but the knowledge I gained from going to Portland was very valuable to me.

I agree with others that have said that having a good relationship with a quality and reputable roaster will help you immensely. I personally have talked to Batdorf & Bronson and their sales rep has sent me several tools that are helping me to work through the costing part of my business plan.

Personally I like the Simonelli Aurelia and this is probably the machine I will use in my shop. I'll be looking at the Monin syrups and Ghiradelli chocolates. So far I'm very impressed with Batdorf & Bronson's customer attentiveness so we'll have to see how I like their coffee samples they send me and go from there. I'm working on a menu currently myself. I'd say just look around at local places in your area, go online to some established shops and see what they have on their menu and then just start picking and choosing and putting things together that will fit what you want to do. It'll be YOURS so do whatever you want. Have fun with it and be creative.

DO you have a location in mind or nailed down? This so far as been the most challenging aspect for me (other than the business plan). Location is so important and the lease terms are just as important as where it is. You have to be sure to negotiate a good lease or else you'll be working your guts out just to pay rent.

Bellissimo (the folks that sponsor and host this website) are great resources for you and I'm not just saying that because this is their site. I've experiences first hand their classes and I believe in those guys expertise. Call them and talk to Matt, Bruce or Ed and they'll get you going in the right direction.

Hope that helps and I'd love to talk with you more about your journey. Message me anytime, maybe we can help each other along with sharing ideas.

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Permalink Reply by Randy on March 6, 2009 at 11:22am

The Synesso Cyncra is an often overlooked espresso machine. It has better or equivalent temperature stability to a LaMarzocco FB/80. It's also easy to do maintenance on. Instead of steam knobs or switches, it has steam levers. They work FANTASTICALLY! You can leave them at any steam level between off and full blast. The machine is made predominantly out of stainless steel. There may be copper tubing, but the boilers and brew groups are fully stainless steel. And my favorite parts; it's LESS EXPENSIVE and MADE IN USA!
Mazzer makes great grinders, but don't overlook good brands like Mahlkonig(Don't let people sway you with speak of clumping. I've seen first hand what causes the clumping, and it's NOT pour grind quality. I think you'd find they're tolerances quite impressive), and Anfim.
I like Monin Syrups quite a bit. Also they're sugar free selection is pretty neat because unlike most other sugar free syrups it doesn't destroy the crema of the espresso. So you can still get good latte art on top of the drink.
Milk pitchers with spouts are good so that you're baristas can pour latte art. Latte art get's customers to come back!
Fetco Coffee brewers are worth it in my opinion.
That's all I can think of for now. I wish you well!

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Permalink Reply by Devon on March 6, 2009 at 11:28am

I, too, am in the business plan stage. I have been researching the industry for a couple of years now - slowly making my way toward the big dream! I took a "fast track" course through my local women's business development center and have attended Coffee Fest the past two years... both very helpful.

Jon... you mentioned working with a specific roaster, which in turn has helped you on the planning end. I know of a couple local roasters here in Chicago (Intelligensia and Metropolis) but I was hoping to do a lot more taste-testing when my big day got closer to help me choose one. Do you suggest picking one with good service to help guide me and possibly switching to someone else to actually get my beans from later? I would feel awfully bad about that! Also, how did you go about choosing one to help you?
Devon

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Permalink Reply by Clint Slagle on March 6, 2009 at 12:47pm

LOCATION LOCATION LOCATION.
I know from experience that the best coffee in the world will not save you from a poor location.

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Permalink Reply by Brady on March 6, 2009 at 1:27pm

CoffeeBuzzMN said:

thanks Brady, i appreciate your input but the lack of information on my profile is a personal choice and NOT a reflection of my experience.
The purpose of my post was really to hear people's preferences in regard to different brands to help with my purchasing choices.
I would also love to hear words of wisdom from those who own their own places, as I am a first time owner--which again does not reflect my experience in the industry.

CB, very glad to hear that. Seen too many nice people that knew nothing about coffee open shops... not good for anyone.


I like Monin for syrups, Ghiradelli caramel sauce, and homemade mocha base. Go with as few syrups as you can get away with... you don't need them all, and every flavor means one in the rack + 1 or 2 in storage. Your inventory will grow fast.

Find at least one flavor or product to build drinks around (umm, besides great espresso) that is unique and that you love. This way you'll become known for great coffee, great service, and for being "that place with the delicious X". Some good options are homemade vanilla, mocha base, an unusual caramel.

Menu-wise, I think simpler is better. This will depend on what your shop philosophy is... friendly neighborhood or cutting edge? If you are more forward leaning, consider a drip-bar for brew-to-order, as well as guest or SO espresso. More neighborhood style - balance the traditional drinks with a few "American style".

Don't mimic Starbies, but do know what they are doing so you can have an informed dialogue and alternative suggestion for the customer that comes in looking for a "Gooey caramel pecan fizz". Some will disagree but, to a customer that thinks that starbx is the top of the heap, not knowing makes you appear dumb or uninformed. Regardless of the truth.

Buy and use ceramic mugs. Too many places are to-go only... don't know about your area, but around here it is an unexpected and nice surprise.

Manage your inventory aggressively, especially beans. Fewer coffees at first so that you can maintain a fresh inventory. That'll mean some hard choices at open but will save you from having to either brew or toss old inventory. You'll ideally want to order everything weekly (at least) so that nothing ever gets too old. Let your demand determine how many coffees you offer.

Good luck!

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Permalink Reply by Mark on March 6, 2009 at 2:39pm

Good point. But more specifically, especially from those who are in business, what makes a good location? Obviously, the corner spot on the busiest walking street is where $bucks goes...and it's also the most expensive. So given the small budgets of newbies, what do you recommend to look for in a location that may be lower in $? This has been my challenge as I too research the prospects of starting out.

Clint Slagle said:

LOCATION LOCATION LOCATION.
I know from experience that the best coffee in the world will not save you from a poor location.

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