eight o'clock coffee vs Starbucks? Who was on the cupping panel? - Barista Exchange2024-03-28T16:18:49Zhttps://www.baristaexchange.com/forum/topics/eight-oclock-coffee-vs?commentId=1688216%3AComment%3A362467&feed=yes&xn_auth=noWell first of all it's Consum…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-09:1688216:Comment:3645682009-03-09T20:52:58.781ZDemian Luperhttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/DemianLuper
Well first of all it's Consumer Reports. Their methods are hardly pure science and they're often called into question. I doubt the panel used proper SCAA protocol or even knew what to look for in the cups.
Well first of all it's Consumer Reports. Their methods are hardly pure science and they're often called into question. I doubt the panel used proper SCAA protocol or even knew what to look for in the cups. Just to add a bit more sarcas…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-08:1688216:Comment:3630432009-03-08T18:44:40.671ZAl Sterlinghttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/AlSterling
Just to add a bit more sarcastic-salt to the wound........ here's a comment from <a href="http://www.chowhound.chow.com">www.chowhound.chow.com</a><br />
<br />
<a href="http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/405924">http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/405924</a><br />
"Dominion is now part of Metro from Quebec, but is still partially owned by A&P. Eight O'Clock is an A&P brand. I'd be surprised if you could find it anywhere else. I recently tried it and found a bag with many defective beans that produced a…
Just to add a bit more sarcastic-salt to the wound........ here's a comment from <a href="http://www.chowhound.chow.com">www.chowhound.chow.com</a><br />
<br />
<a href="http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/405924">http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/405924</a><br />
"Dominion is now part of Metro from Quebec, but is still partially owned by A&P. Eight O'Clock is an A&P brand. I'd be surprised if you could find it anywhere else. I recently tried it and found a bag with many defective beans that produced a wretched brew. It was so bad that I returned the bag for a refund. To each his own, I suppose."<br />
<br />
So because of this CR review, the comments from Chowhound, and this inner-voice I'm now hearing (above that constant ringing) ........ "I want to go to there and buy some" ......... I will probably find myself in-line at the local Walmart, paying for a bag of coffee product. Was this a review, or just a subliminal ad message in the form of a review? Maybe this will put it all in…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-08:1688216:Comment:3630062009-03-08T18:06:36.785ZAl Sterlinghttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/AlSterling
Maybe this will put it all into some perspective........<br />
<br />
I just went to the <a href="http://www.eightoclock.com">www.eightoclock.com</a> website, and did their search for my state, CA.<br />
The qualified and authorized reseller in my area......... WALMART.<br />
<br />
I'll look for CR's next review, when they pit that same easy target against Walmart's own "value oriented" brand......... "Starbucks" vs "Walmart Bucket-O-Coffee."
Maybe this will put it all into some perspective........<br />
<br />
I just went to the <a href="http://www.eightoclock.com">www.eightoclock.com</a> website, and did their search for my state, CA.<br />
The qualified and authorized reseller in my area......... WALMART.<br />
<br />
I'll look for CR's next review, when they pit that same easy target against Walmart's own "value oriented" brand......... "Starbucks" vs "Walmart Bucket-O-Coffee." I forgot to say, Nice Post Ja…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-08:1688216:Comment:3628942009-03-08T15:31:59.411ZJoseph Robertsonhttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/JosephRobertson
I forgot to say, Nice Post Jake.<br />
<br />
<cite>Jake Robinson said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://www.baristaexchange.com/forum/topics/eight-oclock-coffee-vs?page=2&commentId=1688216%3AComment%3A362467&x=1#1688216Comment362467"><div>I think a quote from Uncommon Grounds, (a fabulous book by the way) pretty much sums up this report and other similar reports on this scale.<br></br>"Take a carefully blended, full-bodied, highly aromatic coffee and brew it carefully..., obtaining a heavy, delicate,…</div>
</blockquote>
I forgot to say, Nice Post Jake.<br />
<br />
<cite>Jake Robinson said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://www.baristaexchange.com/forum/topics/eight-oclock-coffee-vs?page=2&commentId=1688216%3AComment%3A362467&x=1#1688216Comment362467"><div>I think a quote from Uncommon Grounds, (a fabulous book by the way) pretty much sums up this report and other similar reports on this scale.<br/>"Take a carefully blended, full-bodied, highly aromatic coffee and brew it carefully..., obtaining a heavy, delicate, enjoyable beverage. Give it to the average coffee-drinker and he will say, 'This is no good.' Then take the same coffee, boil it until all of its delicate characteristics have disappeared and a lye-like drink has been produced and give it to the same man, who will accept it joyfully, exclaiming 'Ah! <i>that</i> is coffee!".<br/>-Charles Trigg, coffee researcher, 1917<br/><br/>Its truly interesting to see this issue being brought up on the exchange, as it was a hot topic of debate for a while amongst our employees during Boston's unusually cold winter. There's a fine line between pushing quality and casting pearls before swine, at least up here in a market so desolate and void of true quality that its rivaled only by the equally harsh winter. There have been lots of "studies" produced lately that exalt certain commercial brands and companies to the top of the chain; this is a dangerous game, as customer education in all gourmet industries is slowed by the misinformed ego. These results effectively shape the consensus of the money spending demographic, who happen to be Boston's most "cup o' commercial Joe" spenders. Getting customers excited about innovation rarely registers beyond the nominal value of xyz product. I don't speak for all Boston coffee shops, but certainly a large number of them. Not to hijack the discussion, but do any of you have similar difficulties? Keeping employees eager to uphold quality for disinterested customers is a daily struggle.</div>
</blockquote> Jake,
Over here on the West s…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-08:1688216:Comment:3628922009-03-08T15:31:19.867ZJoseph Robertsonhttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/JosephRobertson
Jake,<br />
Over here on the West side of the Country 50 miles east of Portland Oregon we see less and less of that "Good Ole cup o' Joe mentality" In a great part due to the explosion of micro coffee shop roasters in a 150 mile radius. In our small roastery / shop we see more and more demand for lighter roasted beans with more flavors and fun in the cup. On a daily basis I see more and more folks asking for espresso drinks without flavors added. I often hear, "I want to taste your roast and the…
Jake,<br />
Over here on the West side of the Country 50 miles east of Portland Oregon we see less and less of that "Good Ole cup o' Joe mentality" In a great part due to the explosion of micro coffee shop roasters in a 150 mile radius. In our small roastery / shop we see more and more demand for lighter roasted beans with more flavors and fun in the cup. On a daily basis I see more and more folks asking for espresso drinks without flavors added. I often hear, "I want to taste your roast and the coffee". The bar for great coffee is raising higher every day and I am having the time of my life striving for that next level.<br />
<cite>Jake Robinson said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://www.baristaexchange.com/forum/topics/eight-oclock-coffee-vs?page=2&commentId=1688216%3AComment%3A362467&x=1#1688216Comment362467"><div>I think a quote from Uncommon Grounds, (a fabulous book by the way) pretty much sums up this report and other similar reports on this scale.<br/>"Take a carefully blended, full-bodied, highly aromatic coffee and brew it carefully..., obtaining a heavy, delicate, enjoyable beverage. Give it to the average coffee-drinker and he will say, 'This is no good.' Then take the same coffee, boil it until all of its delicate characteristics have disappeared and a lye-like drink has been produced and give it to the same man, who will accept it joyfully, exclaiming 'Ah! <i>that</i> is coffee!".<br/>-Charles Trigg, coffee researcher, 1917<br/><br/>Its truly interesting to see this issue being brought up on the exchange, as it was a hot topic of debate for a while amongst our employees during Boston's unusually cold winter. There's a fine line between pushing quality and casting pearls before swine, at least up here in a market so desolate and void of true quality that its rivaled only by the equally harsh winter. There have been lots of "studies" produced lately that exalt certain commercial brands and companies to the top of the chain; this is a dangerous game, as customer education in all gourmet industries is slowed by the misinformed ego. These results effectively shape the consensus of the money spending demographic, who happen to be Boston's most "cup o' commercial Joe" spenders. Getting customers excited about innovation rarely registers beyond the nominal value of xyz product. I don't speak for all Boston coffee shops, but certainly a large number of them. Not to hijack the discussion, but do any of you have similar difficulties? Keeping employees eager to uphold quality for disinterested customers is a daily struggle.</div>
</blockquote> I think a quote from Uncommon…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-08:1688216:Comment:3624672009-03-08T01:41:20.653ZJake Robinsonhttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/JakeRobinson
I think a quote from Uncommon Grounds, (a fabulous book by the way) pretty much sums up this report and other similar reports on this scale.<br />
"Take a carefully blended, full-bodied, highly aromatic coffee and brew it carefully..., obtaining a heavy, delicate, enjoyable beverage. Give it to the average coffee-drinker and he will say, 'This is no good.' Then take the same coffee, boil it until all of its delicate characteristics have disappeared and a lye-like drink has been produced and give it…
I think a quote from Uncommon Grounds, (a fabulous book by the way) pretty much sums up this report and other similar reports on this scale.<br />
"Take a carefully blended, full-bodied, highly aromatic coffee and brew it carefully..., obtaining a heavy, delicate, enjoyable beverage. Give it to the average coffee-drinker and he will say, 'This is no good.' Then take the same coffee, boil it until all of its delicate characteristics have disappeared and a lye-like drink has been produced and give it to the same man, who will accept it joyfully, exclaiming 'Ah! <i>that</i> is coffee!".<br />
-Charles Trigg, coffee researcher, 1917<br />
<br />
Its truly interesting to see this issue being brought up on the exchange, as it was a hot topic of debate for a while amongst our employees during Boston's unusually cold winter. There's a fine line between pushing quality and casting pearls before swine, at least up here in a market so desolate and void of true quality that its rivaled only by the equally harsh winter. There have been lots of "studies" produced lately that exalt certain commercial brands and companies to the top of the chain; this is a dangerous game, as customer education in all gourmet industries is slowed by the misinformed ego. These results effectively shape the consensus of the money spending demographic, who happen to be Boston's most "cup o' commercial Joe" spenders. Getting customers excited about innovation rarely registers beyond the nominal value of xyz product. I don't speak for all Boston coffee shops, but certainly a large number of them. Not to hijack the discussion, but do any of you have similar difficulties? Keeping employees eager to uphold quality for disinterested customers is a daily struggle. I like this thread, and echo…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-08:1688216:Comment:3624012009-03-08T00:22:53.333ZChris Aviretthttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/cavirett
I like this thread, and echo others, not in defense of Starbucks, necessarily, rather coffee in general. Did the testers taste the full Starbucks catalog of coffees? Again I'm not defending Starbucks here, that's not the action in question (to meat least), rather the professionalism with which this tasting was done, if it was a true cupping or tasting or even using a drip method. One can not blanket an entire company's product name by the testing one product that has multiple other equal…
I like this thread, and echo others, not in defense of Starbucks, necessarily, rather coffee in general. Did the testers taste the full Starbucks catalog of coffees? Again I'm not defending Starbucks here, that's not the action in question (to meat least), rather the professionalism with which this tasting was done, if it was a true cupping or tasting or even using a drip method. One can not blanket an entire company's product name by the testing one product that has multiple other equal products and counterpoint them with the single product of another company, simply because it is unparalleled, and undoubtedly unscientific. This is the same action as saying that x Honda vehicle is better than the entire line of Toyota vehicles simply because it [x Honda] out performed the one it was tested against.<br />
<br />
I just read the article posted by Brady, thanks for that Brady, and it's worth the read, simply because it brings to light the inconclusive structure with which it, the article at least, was written. With such little depth, anyone of us that cares, has to wonder to what level correctness the tastings were handled. It does state again, and again that the beans tasted (mind you, only which beans of Eight O'Clock) and it was their 100% Colombian; not once is the origin of the bean from Starbucks, Caribou, and Kickapoo listed, again unscientific.<br />
<br />
This whole article is a couple of things to me, though, both being a bit of light to keep striving for:<br />
<br />
1. an obvious account of the lack of knowledge that the world outside of coffee has<br />
<br />
2. that being said, it is also a great eye opener to the level of knowledge that we have and still, even as professional and habitual coffee lovers, have to learn; reminding us that we are so far from the end to this exciting thing that we have deemed "our love".......COFFEE<br />
<br />
p.s. I'm sorry to have written all of this and not truly answered the topic of this discussion (apologies cultiva_guy). Either way did anyone ever find out who the tasters were. and has the thought of them simply being random consumers been considered? the reason I ask is that this even further biases the "conclusion" of this "study"......of course, as the consumer, I will prefer my favorite to your suggestion as to what I should try. And, assuming this to be a possibility, the term that they use"coffee experts" bears flaws in and of itself.<br />
<br />
Finally, Eight O'clock coffee is also a Consumer Reports Best Buy.....come on. I wonder if they were tasting…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-07:1688216:Comment:3616942009-03-07T03:12:41.490ZStephanie Ratanashttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/StephanieRatanas
I wonder if they were tasting the new starbucks "instant" coffee. Can I get a "packet" of Colombia, please?
I wonder if they were tasting the new starbucks "instant" coffee. Can I get a "packet" of Colombia, please? I agree with Chase. I don't g…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-07:1688216:Comment:3615372009-03-07T00:18:06.529ZMaggie Cookhttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/MaggieCook
I agree with Chase. I don't get it anyway, what coffees were tasted? Because there are definitely coffees better than 8 O'Clock so if that was deemed "best tasting" I don't know that i would trust them anyway...
I agree with Chase. I don't get it anyway, what coffees were tasted? Because there are definitely coffees better than 8 O'Clock so if that was deemed "best tasting" I don't know that i would trust them anyway... Giaco..... insightful comment…tag:www.baristaexchange.com,2009-03-06:1688216:Comment:3615052009-03-06T23:49:50.319ZAl Sterlinghttps://www.baristaexchange.com/profile/AlSterling
Giaco..... insightful comments, and I appreciate that, in essence, you separate the "art of coffee" from the "business of coffee." Two things that pop out in an article like this; Starbucks being the easy target, and the almost "non-sequitor" joining of "Consumer Reports" and "Coffee Ratings."<br />
<br />
I just shake my head when I see an organization like Consumer Reports judging and rating something they know little about. But then, I gave up on Consumer Reports years ago, when they judged cameras,…
Giaco..... insightful comments, and I appreciate that, in essence, you separate the "art of coffee" from the "business of coffee." Two things that pop out in an article like this; Starbucks being the easy target, and the almost "non-sequitor" joining of "Consumer Reports" and "Coffee Ratings."<br />
<br />
I just shake my head when I see an organization like Consumer Reports judging and rating something they know little about. But then, I gave up on Consumer Reports years ago, when they judged cameras, automobiles and motorcycles by criteria that had little or no significance to me.<br />
<br />
With plenty of respect for their expendable income, and as far as I'm concerned, the panel of judges could have been high school kids. Their criteria might have been "Buzz factor" and "Total Deliciousity-ness." At least then I'd know the parameters for the ratings and could somewhat appreciate the results.<br />
<br />
<cite>giacobean said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://www.baristaexchange.com/forum/topics/eight-oclock-coffee-vs#1688216Comment361270"><div>One cannot knock Starbucks for paving the specialty coffee market road. However, their mega-chain presence has left them exposed to the pressures of a falling economy. Starbucks capitalizes on the sale of brewed coffee not bagged coffee. I go to my local grocery stores and check bagged coffee inventory. What consumers dont understand is that the coffee is old before it is even stocked on shelves. I have placed stickers under coffee bags and gone back months later to only see those stickered bags still there. People who buy coffee at the grocery store buy with the mentality that price is more important than quality. Coffee is still seen as a flavor. Unlike wine, more people read into the nuances and charactaristics through each sip. People also dont add a ton of cream and 10 sugars to their glass. I will never tell my customers that my coffee is the best. I tell them to drink Giacobean coffee because its my personal libation of choice. However my motto has always been--Try before you Buy. Dont believe the hype!</div>
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